Tribe.net. Local Connections Devidas http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#b2bd226b-9b5f-4675-9839-4f8e04395bcf 2009-09-23T02:53:37Z 2009-09-23T02:53:37Z

She, through a series of processes of modification or expansion called parinamas, has BECOME the universe. Different form, same essence (like thread when it is woven into cloth). There is nothing in the universe (including you and me) that is not part of Her. Flowers, water, incense, grain, and us are all part of Her, so what can we offer to Her? I guess the answer is our love and devotion. I don't think the sacrifice of animals, which are part of Her, will do it. Jai Ma! --Devidas

Devidas 2009-09-23T02:53:37Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#bd2f5ae6-77ad-4bb4-847b-3a7a7bfb22d9 2009-09-12T03:51:17Z 2009-09-12T03:51:17Z

If any of my messages hurts you then I appologise to you and all other friends. thanx for your support. Pls forgive me. Bye bye

Sidhu 2009-09-12T03:51:17Z Conan http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#5f1fba5f-d87b-45d9-99a8-92c118d7013c 2009-09-09T20:20:53Z 2009-09-09T20:20:53Z

Well...this is most interesting. Will you post it on this Tribe when you have been sacrificed. And please enlighten me if it did just a little pain of that you suffered very much. Since this priestess appears not to sacrifice humans every day it will probably very bloody. As example of a freakaccident you are obliged now to keep us posted. Besides that you are making the americans under us criminals by american law if they don't do any action with your story. Should you end up in prison or psychiatric hospital I wish you the best in walking your way. I do agree on another post on this topic: if you really want to forfil your dream then devote your life to Kali. That's a real sacrifice.

Conan 2009-09-09T20:20:53Z Shambhalanth http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#cb94357e-7a54-47b3-a958-9392c20686d7 2009-09-09T19:39:05Z 2009-09-09T19:39:05Z

PLEASE DON'T FEED THE TROLLS! Just give Sidhu the comedian a Darwin Award and let it go.

Shambhalanth 2009-09-09T19:39:05Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#c71f7530-82f5-4ad8-a027-2aed4f398aee 2009-09-07T09:53:07Z 2009-09-07T09:53:07Z

The lady tantrik has convinced me that I'd get immortality if I allow her to sacrifice myself to Kali. I'd be associated with Kali permanently as Godess Kali will give me a place either in her hand or in her chain of severed heads. She has given me many examples from ancient times and remove my all fears. She has asked me to reach Tarapith on 19th and sacrifice me on 20th, in midnight of amabashya. She will operate the sword and her female followers will assist her. Good bye to all, may Kali bless you all.

Sidhu 2009-09-07T09:53:07Z Ol Soul Young Heart http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#f4c4bbeb-a0fd-40f4-83aa-bdf0f6cb32e5 2009-09-06T15:50:46Z 2009-09-06T15:50:46Z

This seems to be pointing toward a basic spiritual problem. On one level, it is overcoming fear of death, on another it is the willingness to suffer and sacrifice. To me, Kali (who I know only a little of) is a spiritual archetype, and one that we must all face, but to reduce that to the level of carnivourous demanding God is an error, one that comes from us. All spiritual and Religeous doctrines suffer this problem, the reduction of their deeper principles toward crude physical substitutes. This is inevitable because those who are less spiritually developed have no other way(s) of understanding. To me, you could get your head chopped off but it may not do anything for your spiritual path, and would most likely create bad karma for the other participant(s). FYI - I was once told by a well known western intuitive that I got axed in a past life (seems I was something of a Religeous heretic), and it hasn't done anything for me, that I can tell, in this lifetime. Of course I wasn't willing, but then I think that that would have been a waste of a perfectly good lifetime! On the level of suffering and sacrifice, sounds to me like getting your head chopped off is the easy way out. How about suffering and sacrificing in this lifetime for the sake of others? Mother Terasa did it that way, and it was a Joy for her.

Ol Soul Young Heart 2009-09-06T15:50:46Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#43bb182a-b6b1-4e59-b2b4-6e695c64ddfd 2009-09-06T15:49:13Z 2009-09-06T15:49:13Z

Maa Kali is within everyone- as is every Devatha in the universe. So say the scriptures. So why sacrifice yourself to Maa Kali when you can become HER ???? Why not get to a point where you can call Maa Kali within you ? ???????????? Even if you are sacrificed to Her, you may go to Her- but isnt it better to merge/realise your identity with Her. There are multiple layers of meaning even to the scriptures. Why are you taking the easy way out ? There are lots of siddhas there in Tarapeeth. Why not get initiated, leave your life behind and spend your life doing Her sadhana ? There is no sacrifice on earth which is better than this.. In general, sacrifices are used for kamya prayoga. Sacrifices- even those of animals- are not an absolute necessity in any upasana. If you love Maa Kali- why are you taking the easy way out ? Realise your identity with the Mother of the Universe. Even if you attain the loka of a devatha, the scriptures say that one is not released until one realises ones identity with Her. Whatever happens- may Maa Kali give you good buddhi.

Durgaputra 2009-09-06T15:49:13Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#e5c52aec-fe81-4cc8-b4a2-22a33f05d265 2009-09-06T04:16:38Z 2009-09-06T04:16:38Z

I don't have any intention to attract attention of others. I discussed my dream with all of you and you repplied and send me many suggestions. I feel when I got a solution then it is my duty to inform those persons who once helped me to solve the problem. Thanks.

Sidhu 2009-09-06T04:16:38Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#21d0d81d-6177-4587-9c60-48c1873ceb6a 2009-09-06T02:26:01Z 2009-09-06T02:26:01Z

What Sidhu is proposing would be 1st-degree murder in the States. I imagine it would be in India as well. While it's a very creative way to arrange a suicide, the whole project is nothing more than the infantile reenactment of a myth. ATTENTION: MYTHS ARE ALLEGORIES, not literal realities one can experience, outside mental aberration. I think Sidhu is pulling our leg, or, he's looking for attention for some reason. Having his head chopped off will only result in one thing: his death. And maybe the murderer's incarceration after the fact.

jody 2009-09-06T02:26:01Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#c09a1128-ef94-46f0-a080-42451df7aea0 2009-09-05T19:13:11Z 2009-09-05T19:13:11Z

What do u mean by 2nd or 3rd opinion? She has agreed to sacrifice me on behalf of Maa Kali. She will call Maa Kali within her and then accept my sacrifice by chopping my head in a one swift moion of sword, the Hindu traditional way.

Sidhu 2009-09-05T19:13:11Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#f9c4ba3c-d54f-490f-a7ab-0dc7aa7fe1f3 2009-09-05T13:30:55Z 2009-09-05T13:30:55Z

Errr- all tantrikas are not good people. You really need to be careful. If this really happens, I guess the tantrika is the lucky person. If you forget about temporal law, a willing sacrifice will give her the benefit without the bad karma of murder. The souls of the sacrifice are indeed supposed to reach the diety- but there are better ways to do that. But even she does not really need to do this for either siddhi or moksha- these are typically done for mundane things. Could you get a second or 3rd opinion ?

Durgaputra 2009-09-05T13:30:55Z jeremy http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#fe31f180-c0a3-41c3-b6de-af686e470fbf 2009-08-27T18:28:55Z 2009-08-27T18:28:55Z

This thread is hilarious. Sidhu, if you're for real, go hug this one out with a therapist, your delusions of grandeur are too great.

jeremy 2009-08-27T18:28:55Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#08c0ecc8-1ef9-4d46-a494-4beaaa6bffe8 2009-08-27T03:33:39Z 2009-08-27T03:33:39Z

I went to Tarapith and met a lady Tantrik and explained everything to her. She told me that I'm a very lucky person as maa Kali wants my sacrifice. She has agreed to sacrifice me in next Amabasya or in any Amabasya. Thank you all for your support. bye.

Sidhu 2009-08-27T03:33:39Z CANDICE http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#1ccdd67d-8887-43b2-88cb-1649d34f6ccd 2009-02-25T02:59:22Z 2009-02-25T02:59:22Z

WOW..........

CANDICE 2009-02-25T02:59:22Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#2bef6a31-3ea3-40ec-b04b-b18a6548bb95 2009-02-20T03:40:50Z 2009-02-20T03:40:50Z

I got a news from news paper that a lady has sacrificed her husband infront of Kalimaa for her pleasure. She has been arrested by police and she is a "Tantrik". This has happend at Tarapith, west bengal. I'd feel myself very lucky and honoured if someone choose me for the same event.

Sidhu 2009-02-20T03:40:50Z Conan http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#b68ab441-f672-4112-83b7-3331ef536fa2 2009-02-15T10:39:57Z 2009-02-15T10:39:57Z

as someone who has sacrificed a goat to Kali I can tell you it's liberating

Conan 2009-02-15T10:39:57Z CANDICE http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#5f1cb1f4-46f2-4350-98a5-122d1b8d6c44 2009-02-11T09:25:23Z 2009-02-11T09:25:23Z

YEAH, THAT FEELS RIGHT TO ME.

CANDICE 2009-02-11T09:25:23Z CANDICE http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#612f02b0-06cc-4d39-94ac-5c5e4e02b2c3 2009-02-11T09:23:59Z 2009-02-11T09:23:59Z

MAYBE THE GOAT "SENARIO" STAYS WITH YOU AS IN "KARMA"

CANDICE 2009-02-11T09:23:59Z CANDICE http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#149fe2ba-8d97-4335-9c3a-8420c5b4d851 2009-02-11T09:20:49Z 2009-02-11T09:20:49Z

THIS IS OBVIOUSLY A GUESS, BUT I WOULD SAY SHE WANTS YOU TO GIVE HER YOUR WHOLE HEART. MAYBE THE BLOOD SHE WANTS IS HER WAY OF SHOWING YOU THE DEPTH OF HOW MUCH SHE WANTS YOU AND SHARES IN YOUR PAIN? OM KALI

CANDICE 2009-02-11T09:20:49Z CANDICE http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#a2feb7b9-4afc-4e85-870f-33be083fab67 2009-02-11T07:46:15Z 2009-02-11T07:46:15Z

I really have to wonder if this particular aspect of the puja was really meant to be symbolic. At the end of the day, doesn't Ma lead us ultimately, to sacrifice or offer, your own life symbolically. (Not by killing ourselfs, but by killing our ego). She also leads us to give her our heart, (alive of course) and our will to be her will. It really is esoteric what is required to become liberated. Then again, I wonder if anyone became liberated during the sacrificing of an animal. It could happen.....i just dont know...........

CANDICE 2009-02-11T07:46:15Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#b89ab8d0-e809-42f0-a96a-6dec285a978d 2009-01-29T21:43:55Z 2009-01-29T21:43:55Z

> In other words, she is a personification of the Universe itself ***** That's a way of seeing Her. Another way is to imagine She frames the Universe in a reflection of the cultural institution of motherhood.

jody 2009-01-29T21:43:55Z $item.owner.firstName http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#fa584408-f0ff-4d87-b547-a5cba86db1ee 2009-01-29T21:33:21Z 2009-01-29T21:33:21Z

"We are all part of Her. There is no part of the universe- physical or mental which is not part of Her." In other words, she is a personification of the Universe itself.

$item.owner.firstName 2009-01-29T21:33:21Z Conan http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#84eefb4b-d473-46b7-851d-6d0ee75e2fa5 2009-01-29T19:00:17Z 2009-01-29T19:00:17Z

the sacrifice for Kali goes as far as the catholic communion where you eat the body of Christ

Conan 2009-01-29T19:00:17Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#780f8f74-d911-4aab-9f1e-7a47b9c0b0ab 2009-01-29T18:07:37Z 2009-01-29T18:07:37Z

I'm relishing your agreement, Durgaputra! :)

jody 2009-01-29T18:07:37Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#7eccdf3a-ccea-42c5-8189-59c387c42d55 2009-01-29T17:03:43Z 2009-01-29T17:03:43Z

Jody, for once I agree with you ;-) .

Durgaputra 2009-01-29T17:03:43Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#a7c9a179-a8aa-44a8-95eb-f52e9dc7bafc 2009-01-29T16:03:04Z 2009-01-29T16:02:35Z

> When you say "We are all meat for the Mother," do you mean that she is going to eat us? ***** Another way to say this would be: "We are all the meat OF the Mother," meaning, we are all comprised of the material and energetic essence of the Mahashakti, as She is described by Shankara.

jody 2009-01-29T16:02:35Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#482ddd28-5a9e-4230-ad4e-033a8aaa1613 2009-01-29T08:08:43Z 2009-01-29T08:08:43Z

We are all part of Her. There is no part of the universe- physical or mental which is not part of Her. So creation, destruction and sustenance of the universe are all Her acts. We have a saying what goes for the macrocosm, goes for the microcosm. This means even at individual level, She creates us, sustains us and destroys us. A problem with these things for the outsider is that there are many layers of meaning- as much as 7, depending on the level of awareness of the listener. This concept is true even in the case of Sufi Islam. As a general comment, IMHO it is better to stick to one path and understand that one and the Source at a deep,intuitive level rather than becoming a scholar in a million paths, knowing only the surface meaning of things.

Durgaputra 2009-01-29T08:08:43Z $item.owner.firstName http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#309a6e27-c6ef-4409-bf52-203ffb5701e6 2009-01-29T05:34:06Z 2009-01-29T05:34:06Z

For the record, I am a devout Christian. While I won't actually convert to Hinduism or Shaktism, I am merely attempting to clarify how its belief system and pantheon work, so as either to verify or to repudiate certain references thereto that I have made in the past. Now, onto the main point of this comment. You mentioned a certain literalness in the metaphor of sacrifice. When you say "We are all meat for the Mother," do you mean that she is going to eat us?

$item.owner.firstName 2009-01-29T05:34:06Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#ef9d3418-c796-423f-92ac-c6e6d5441fea 2008-08-08T09:59:10Z 2008-08-08T09:59:10Z

Dear Sidhu, Most dreams are NOT to be taken literally. Sacrifice your "self" - your ego to her. She will be more pleased than if you merely sacrifice your body.

Durgaputra 2008-08-08T09:59:10Z Saul http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#2dbf28c7-43bb-47bd-8160-398bc5893315 2008-08-08T03:16:52Z 2008-08-08T03:16:52Z

I too find the idea of a spiritual goat slave to be rather silly. what is wrong with just giving thanks for dinner?

Saul 2008-08-08T03:16:52Z Amber http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#e2d2434c-b4fd-4f14-8a0f-da9590b27d54 2008-08-08T02:49:00Z 2008-08-08T02:49:00Z

". . . . .we're all just living and dying, being born and getting old. I can't put into words the sheer magnitude of that feeling of connection to all living things. we are all meat for the Mother, sacrifices to Her glory, part of the big majestic wheel of this dirty, bloody, beautiful creation." perfection Amber

Amber 2008-08-08T02:49:00Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#3c6b7d75-15a4-4a61-b42c-6c0de1d55a4a 2008-08-06T04:04:07Z 2008-08-06T04:04:07Z

Actualy, I saw in my dream that Maa was standing infront of the chopping block or sacrifice block, swords in her hand and calling me for sacrifice. This may be nightmare or Maa really wants this.

Sidhu 2008-08-06T04:04:07Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#2a284c60-99ce-4a32-9c4f-c81fd125b7d5 2008-08-02T15:17:09Z 2008-08-02T15:17:09Z

> There is animal instinct in each human unless attained divinity, ***** Divinity is not attained, it is recognized as being an always existent inner truth. You don't get divine, you recognize you've always been divine, even while you've been your most base and animal-like. The animal in us doesn't get in the way of the divine, it merely distracts us from seeing that we've always been divine. > We have to sacrifice our animal instinct not the animal. ***** We have to sacrifice the idea that we need to be anything other than what we are right now, which will always be animals with language skills that happen to be divine at the origin of their awareness.

jody 2008-08-02T15:17:09Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#08d13ef2-20c5-4121-aafc-ab235b90713e 2008-08-02T03:25:07Z 2008-08-02T03:25:07Z

You are right. However, we should all not indulge in group think. Sacrifice is OK at one stage, but not OK at another. In other words, ones practice changes between Pashu, Vira and Daiva bhavas. There is no such thing as one size fits all in upasana or mantra sastra.

Durgaputra 2008-08-02T03:25:07Z Vijay http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#8cff5eb2-f1a1-4e49-b58d-05fbd43de8a3 2008-08-01T21:03:21Z 2008-08-01T21:03:21Z

There is animal instinct in each human unless attained divinity, We have to sacrifice our animal instinct not the animal.

Vijay 2008-08-01T21:03:21Z Grihastha http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#7af7e4e2-3fc5-4f31-9361-e024ba99a88b 2008-08-01T20:56:57Z 2008-08-01T20:56:57Z

I visualize myself as Chhinnamasta. In that way I am the sacrifice to my Devi. Bliss. To answer the original question, I haven't seen the animal sacrifices to Ma except on film. I intend to go to Kalighat so I will see them for real at some point. I'm sure it has heavy significance in context. Personally I don't think the death of animals is necessary to appease or please Ma: She isn't a person or a thing with appetites or emotions. She is us. So if we are horrified by the slaughter, then She is too. Similarly if we are gratified by it, so is She. For me, the ambiguity makes it senseless. Anyway our lives have sacrifice built into them: we die. Better to find ways to turn that short life into a hymn of giving ourselves up to Her, to simply being Her; make joyful offerings of ourselves every day and dance like Shri Chhinnamasta.

Grihastha 2008-08-01T20:56:57Z Adya http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#792da707-f0f8-4e96-84d6-f09583397767 2008-08-01T18:37:42Z 2008-08-01T18:37:42Z

>> "When I sacrificed a goat at Kalighat in Kolkata, India, I was told by the priest that the soul would stay with me not go to Kali." I was responding to this statement in my first post.

Adya 2008-08-01T18:37:42Z Adya http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#dda18843-9e1a-4967-8ac1-6f143e870313 2008-08-01T18:32:08Z 2008-08-01T18:31:11Z

as to the main idea of this thread, sacrifice as it is being discussed here is in its crudest or gross form of offering... not needed in this age by any means, Imo.. there is an abundance of collective karma for all of us to work off in this age already, we need no more goat sacrifices, human sacrifces or any gross form of sacrices, we need to sacrifice our egos, greed, jealousy, thoughts, emotions, etc. Time to evolve dear ones... ~Om Shanti

Adya 2008-08-01T18:31:11Z Adya http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#35a11a7c-f0f0-40a8-90f6-9841d628d645 2008-08-01T18:25:30Z 2008-08-01T18:23:44Z

from my pov, which the judges may not agree with :) the karma of taking the life of the goat is now entangled with yours and your responsibility to work it all out in this life or another, a complicated matter, and not easily summed up in a few words...but, as Kali Ma eats our karma, if we offer it to Her wholeheartedly through proper puja, then it will all work itself out. of course i'm not recommending anyone try this at home : )

Adya 2008-08-01T18:23:44Z Grihastha http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#ff52448f-a6e4-4e64-a547-9d197f9774aa 2008-08-01T17:47:10Z 2008-08-01T17:47:10Z

sorry - should have written 'siddhis.'

Grihastha 2008-08-01T17:47:10Z Grihastha http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#70e30dd4-b0d5-4702-b500-20573980abb1 2008-08-01T17:44:24Z 2008-08-01T17:44:24Z

Somehow it doesn't seem very enlightened - enslaving a goat ghost. I mean even conceptually. Quite apart from how useful a goat ghost might be (not very - no opposable thumbs for one thing), doesn't it imply ownership of essentially someone/something's jiva? Impossible from the viewpoint of nonduality, surely? From my point of view impossible anyway, but I'm interested to know how the notion gets squared with the theological/philosophical precepts - same goes for siddhas that promise power over others.

Grihastha 2008-08-01T17:44:24Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#155ada63-0f17-4fe3-a770-34b1af72e56b 2008-08-01T16:31:48Z 2008-08-01T16:31:48Z

> he explained it as being protected by the goatghost. ***** "Included in your goat sacrifice fee – all at no additional charge – is a lifetime's worth of protection by the goat ghost!" I wouldn't put much stock in the powers of the goat ghost, but have every confidence that your belief in the goat ghost is all that is necessary to provide the desired "protection."

jody 2008-08-01T16:31:48Z Conan http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#fab3cc32-2061-4c2d-9437-c12f9f6fe6e7 2008-08-01T08:58:40Z 2008-08-01T08:58:40Z

Well...he explained it as being protected by the goatghost. Which was an extra since the ritual already was a blessing for me and my family of Kali.

Conan 2008-08-01T08:58:40Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#18e3ca94-a8ab-47f5-8307-be6f13ba3667 2008-08-01T04:15:17Z 2008-08-01T04:15:17Z

In other words- you are going to be haunted by the soul of the goat ?

Durgaputra 2008-08-01T04:15:17Z jody http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#c2c80517-0122-4d5d-8d06-f571172bfed7 2008-07-31T18:51:02Z 2008-07-31T18:51:02Z

> I was told by the priest that the soul would stay with me not go to Kali. ***** That sounds like marketing to me, the idea you could possess the soul of another being, like you're getting something for the money you spent on the sacrifice.

jody 2008-07-31T18:51:02Z Conan http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#65a5781d-df50-49b4-a3ec-ec852b4af5d8 2008-07-31T17:56:45Z 2008-07-31T17:56:45Z

When I sacrificed a goat at Kalighat in Kolkata, India, I was told by the priest that the soul would stay with me not go to Kali.

Conan 2008-07-31T17:56:45Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#e3b3feb0-eb23-4e1d-8ec7-01deb74a97ad 2008-07-30T16:02:45Z 2008-07-30T16:02:45Z

Sidhu, You can sacrifice yourself to Her without spilling any blood. Remember, bereft of our illusions, desires, aspirations,likes, dislikes and the like we are nothing but Her. Sacrifice all those things which define you as distinct from her- that is upasana, that is sacrifice- ultimately that is the path to bliss. Is is difficult too as it is to be done in every moment. Every person's mind plays tricks. Do not take dreams literally. See if you can divine the inner meaning. Jai Maa Kali.

Durgaputra 2008-07-30T16:02:45Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#56426007-48db-4371-8983-76b56e5cfbd1 2008-07-30T12:52:02Z 2008-07-30T12:52:02Z

Actually, I've seen Maa in dream and she was asking me for my own blood. She wanted my sacrifice. I'm agreed for my own sacrifice but in this modern era, who will dare to sacrifice me to Maa Kali? If any one has any solution, pls mail me to sidhu167@hotmail.com

Sidhu 2008-07-30T12:52:02Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#41a33aa1-846d-4abb-ad5c-735ecc98f04f 2008-06-09T16:10:30Z 2008-06-09T16:10:30Z

I know entire organisations of people who do- and they only oppose sacrifices because they consider it a superstition. I am NOT referring to PETA here- I respect them, their cause and their commitment.

Durgaputra 2008-06-09T16:10:30Z Prabuddh http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#db0df88f-8f09-422f-8818-44d56f6ae5d3 2008-06-08T22:15:02Z 2008-06-08T22:15:02Z

You don't know if these people eat animals.

Prabuddh 2008-06-08T22:15:02Z Vijay http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#029ab04d-1945-40b7-8f48-8a221389f40c 2008-06-08T19:53:23Z 2008-06-08T19:53:23Z

Animal sacrifice is not convincing. What has been said by Rasa, I m in full agreement.

Vijay 2008-06-08T19:53:23Z Durgaputra http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#7ea5f166-e792-4ff5-bab9-078979968b8e 2008-06-08T08:25:51Z 2008-06-08T08:25:51Z

I think the animals being sacrificed are treated more humanely than in an abbatoir. Then again their souls go to Her- which is a blessing for them. I find it extremely funny and foolish that people who eat animals killed for food oppose animal sacrifice to Gods and Goddesses. The Ultimate sacrifice I believe, is of oneself- ones ego, desires, self - to say that you alone are important -Mother, and everything else is less important or not important to me. This is more difficult and may take many lifetimes to complete. Om Namaschandikayai.

Durgaputra 2008-06-08T08:25:51Z $item.owner.firstName http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#f93328fe-92dd-44dc-ac76-a2f6a8559671 2008-06-08T03:07:45Z 2008-06-08T03:07:45Z

no. i was in Goa a few months and my dad kicked me out.

$item.owner.firstName 2008-06-08T03:07:45Z Saul http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#71b238bb-ee1a-4ea5-9dc8-cb0a8b2b5b62 2008-06-08T02:58:36Z 2008-06-08T02:58:36Z

I dunno, if someone was snapping photos maybe I'd look too! hehe. when we were there they weren't letting anyone take any photos - at Dakshineshwar a woman got kicked out by armed guards because she tried to take photographs in the courtyard. so who knows? I think because of the bombing in Varanasi before we went the mandirs were all really paranoid. are you in India?

Saul 2008-06-08T02:58:36Z $item.owner.firstName http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#f4695e36-c9de-49b4-9b7a-3bacd64ddbb8 2008-06-08T02:46:57Z 2008-06-08T02:46:57Z

i agree. i guess i want to see the rite fulfilled wholeheartedly at least. see i saw a photo of a sacrifice taking place, and the man holding down the goat was looking into the camera.. which seems kinda senseless or mindless.

$item.owner.firstName 2008-06-08T02:46:57Z Saul http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#bb6ea511-bc9f-41d7-a0ef-79096e5e242d 2008-06-07T21:02:47Z 2008-06-07T21:02:47Z

I think you should see it either way - just to see if you are comfortable with it. but that's just my opinion. anyway, the area is more lively on Saturdays and Tuesdays. there are also schedules for when you can receive darshan - there are two windows during the day that you can see Ma, we went just slightly late right before we left Kolkata and missed darshan by like 7 people.

Saul 2008-06-07T21:02:47Z Rasa http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#9576d35a-5102-4ec0-a020-5e965d1e9b88 2008-06-07T17:14:49Z 2008-06-07T17:14:49Z

And likewise worship and Sadhanas can be as crude or as subtle as the person performing it. People and their actions are on varying levels of crudeness and subtleness. The *lighter* you become and the further away from crude existence you travel the more subtle your actions become.

Rasa 2008-06-07T17:14:49Z Rasa http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#727d7893-9655-464a-b671-7ff41a642b09 2008-06-07T17:12:21Z 2008-06-07T17:12:21Z

I agree. I am just presenting that many scriptures have deep esoteric meanings when they describe animal sacrifice and human sacrifice. There are three modes of worship, that of the Pashu or herd animal approach which is worshipping with physical elements, the VIra or heroic approach which is purely mental, and the Divya or Divine mode that is transcendent of mental and physical worship. You can sacrifice the animal or the human or use the panchamakara in all three ways. It just depends on what level you are on, and how you interpret the methods the scriptures give based on your level of development. All three methods are effective.

Rasa 2008-06-07T17:12:21Z $item.owner.firstName http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#7db84f8e-28f2-490c-9991-9797d0874ab3 2008-06-07T06:44:19Z 2008-06-07T06:44:19Z

>If you really want to worship physically and you really want to please Maa, there's no better way then offering your own blood and not the animal for the sake of your own benefit.< yepyep! i reckon sacrifice of something other than self [or anything seen as an attachment] is only representative. offering up a proxy is pretty fainthearted. and i'm not sure how fond Kali is of ritual and pretense. i went to Kalighat last year, but at a time of day when she was veiled. the sacrificial square was empty; bleak and stark. the ambiance in the neighbourhood was heavy thick like a dreamstate that evaporated as i walked back to the trainstation. all the people were so quiet and contained.. so different to the rest of the city.. i was surprised when a stallholder took the conch shell i was looking at and blew it.. and timid when he gave it to me to try. but my bastard father wouldn't give me the time to be wanton so i felt like a total fool not buying it after the demonstration [i went with the intent of stocking up on as much iconography as i could :D but walked away without a single thing. lame! but for those who haven't been, the few blocks leading to the temple are loaded with market stalls in Kali's honour] so anyway i wonder if days around the Kalighat are always like that, or if it was because Kali was sleeping or doing whatever she does in her private time. i'll probably go at the same time next time just to see. and so i don't see the sacrifice again!

$item.owner.firstName 2008-06-07T06:44:19Z Saul http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#75c434c4-3691-446a-b65b-be731b97c985 2008-06-07T00:39:11Z 2008-06-07T00:39:11Z

I think that while what you are saying has some truth, it is also a mistake to take things too *symbolically* as well. not just on this issue but on many. the panchamakara for example, while symbolizing other things, is also meant literally - taking a position at either end of the spectrum is missing out on the whole picture. anyway, the goats get slaughtered pretty quickly and don't suffer. they were destined for dinner anyway, they might as well be prashad! in any case, I think for most people, pure dakshinamarga is not enough; the collision between the self and experiences which are threatening or uncomfortable is needed. it is a lot different to talk about sacrifice than it is to see it. I didn't know how I would feel about many things on Kali Puja at Kalighat - the ritual slaughter of the goats, the corpses laid out at the smashan, etc... for me, Shaktism needs no reform. I am of the opinion that if I felt any of these practices were vile or in error, it would not have been my way. my fiancee is a vegetarian and not Hindu, and she was very comfortable with bali after she witnessed it. there is a wonderful connection with the cycle of life inherent in such a day. life! the surge of humanity, baking in the sun! the joy of people to see and be seen by Mother! death! the end of animals' lives, and what remains when we too have been laid to rest! flowers, smoke, blood, singing, the sweat of thousands of people... we're all just living and dying, being born and getting old. I can't put into words the sheer magnitude of that feeling of connection to all living things. we are all meat for the Mother, sacrifices to Her glory, part of the big majestic wheel of this dirty, bloody, beautiful creation. JAI MA!

Saul 2008-06-07T00:39:11Z Rasa http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#42227f5f-2544-40cc-8715-b681996f3bed 2008-06-06T23:23:16Z 2008-06-06T23:23:16Z

I think that most people who worship in the mode of the Pashu take certain offerings too literally and do not see the esoteric meaning in animal and human sacrifice. But then again that's just my two cents. If you really want to worship physically and you really want to please Maa, there's no better way then offering your own blood and not the animal for the sake of your own benefit. It's selfish to take lives for pujas especially for benefit, in my opinion, and like everything it has it's karmic repercussions.

Rasa 2008-06-06T23:23:16Z Saul http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#f93e1c77-977f-48b1-9793-3c533dfb530c 2008-06-05T22:56:10Z 2008-06-05T22:56:10Z

I have witnessed bali. I see nothing wrong with animal sacrifice. they get a clean death, are offered to Ma and eaten. no problem. I can't really see a better way for an animal to be slaughtered. the question of whether animals should be eaten period is IMHO it's own topic of personal morality and is outside the realm of Shaktism.

Saul 2008-06-05T22:56:10Z jeremy http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#631d847d-0faf-49f3-9dac-f76872a8c021 2008-06-05T21:04:32Z 2008-06-05T21:04:32Z

No, I haven't seen it, but I have an opinion anyway... :) I'm not sure if I would use terms like right/wrong, but personally I would find animal sacrifice useless and pointless (then again I am not Hindu either and I am a vegetarian, so take that however you will). Religious traditions are very culturally ingrained and vice versa. It's important to understand what is important to one's spirituality and what is actually important to the culture and the time. Some religious practices and beliefs do nothing more than serve class/race issues and others are pure superstition, it's the seeing thru that cultural ignorance (meaning unchallenged thought, not stupidity) that is ultimately important. But everyone has to determine that individually. I'm very interested in seeing how others respond to this thread.

jeremy 2008-06-05T21:04:32Z Rasa http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#50dd7975-32a8-4a93-b1e5-43a1b518ad19 2008-06-05T17:33:03Z 2008-06-05T17:33:03Z

Each animal including the human is symbolic of aspects of the self that should be sacrificed to her in order to be liberated.

Rasa 2008-06-05T17:33:03Z Sidhu http://kalima.tribe.net/thread/e439457f-f654-414a-b6cb-d150c83519ca#a99f288a-d508-4b6c-9d63-51180b77414b 2008-06-05T12:45:11Z 2008-06-05T12:45:11Z

Have any of you ever seen the animal sacrifice duri Kali Puja? Pls explain the same with your feelings like whether it is wrong or right or you enjoyed it or not etc.

Sidhu 2008-06-05T12:45:11Z